reverse brake bleed

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remmington
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Re: reverse brake bleed

Post by remmington » Wed Aug 29, 2018 5:53 pm

This raises the question?

Do you always apply the front and rear brake at the same time?

(more pressure to the front and light foot pressure on the rear brake pedal).

Or are you using the rear brake like a emergency extra brake when you need to come to a stop quickly?

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Diesel Dave
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Re: reverse brake bleed

Post by Diesel Dave » Fri Aug 31, 2018 6:23 pm

How you brake really depends on th type of bike you’re riding.

On a sports bike with powerful brakes in the dry there’s little to be gained by using the rear brake unless you overcook it into a corner then it’s handy to drag a little rear brake. Mostly used to stabilise the bike during ‘power on’ so the chain can be tensioned in the correct direction.

A mate had a Guzzi California with linked brakes back in the 1980’s and never used the handlebar lever to the point where the unused calliper seized.

The TLS brake on the front of my Enfield was vicious so attempting to use it in the wet would pretty much always result in a front wheel lock up, so all the braking was with the engine and rear brake. I’ve upgraded to a disk but someone needs to teach Royal Enfield about the importance of getting the hydraulic ratio correct as it’s completely wooden.

On a C90 you have to learn the correct braking technique (unless you have the torque arm version), it’s vital that you don’t panic grab the front brake as this will skip the front wheel and then lock it up. I’m with Newt on setup so you should only just be capable of locking the wheel when the lever hits the bars. Too many have the cable set tight and you have almost no leverage and therefor power. Take up the fork movement gently with the brake and then apply hard and it will stop very quickly.

I’ve had many scooters with linked brakes and I’m not a fan, I prefer to change the ratio of front to rear brake effort depending on the weather - nowadays I suppose ABS is supposed to sort this for you.

remmington
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Re: reverse brake bleed

Post by remmington » Fri Aug 31, 2018 7:48 pm

Diesel Dave wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 6:23 pm
How you brake really depends on th type of bike you’re riding.

On a sports bike with powerful brakes in the dry there’s little to be gained by using the rear brake unless you overcook it into a corner then it’s handy to drag a little rear brake. Mostly used to stabilise the bike during ‘power on’ so the chain can be tensioned in the correct direction.

A mate had a Guzzi California with linked brakes back in the 1980’s and never used the handlebar lever to the point where the unused calliper seized.

The TLS brake on the front of my Enfield was vicious so attempting to use it in the wet would pretty much always result in a front wheel lock up, so all the braking was with the engine and rear brake. I’ve upgraded to a disk but someone needs to teach Royal Enfield about the importance of getting the hydraulic ratio correct as it’s completely wooden.

On a C90 you have to learn the correct braking technique (unless you have the torque arm version), it’s vital that you don’t panic grab the front brake as this will skip the front wheel and then lock it up. I’m with Newt on setup so you should only just be capable of locking the wheel when the lever hits the bars. Too many have the cable set tight and you have almost no leverage and therefor power. Take up the fork movement gently with the brake and then apply hard and it will stop very quickly.

I’ve had many scooters with linked brakes and I’m not a fan, I prefer to change the ratio of front to rear brake effort depending on the weather - nowadays I suppose ABS is supposed to sort this for you.

When braking on any motorbike - I use both brakes always - more pressure to the front brake and sort of feather the rear - laying on more pressure to the rear if I want stop really quickly (emergency).

I am 51 - and have had a full motorcycle licence since I was 17.

Am I using them as I should do?

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Newtsalad
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Re: reverse brake bleed

Post by Newtsalad » Fri Aug 31, 2018 11:31 pm

^^^^ YUp.

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bikerbaker
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Re: reverse brake bleed

Post by bikerbaker » Sat Sep 01, 2018 12:38 pm

I was taught to use the front brake fractionally before the rear. Indeed this was one of the questions asked on my bike test in 1967. :lol:

Recently however I realised that I have been getting into the habit of using just the front brake only so have been consciously trying to do the right thing. Unfortunately the 2000 SV650 rear caliper was suffering from lack of use and seized on which was a trifle embarrassing on the ride home. Caliper now replaced (surprisingly with a recon unit from a Hayabusa) and all good.

Must get round to straightening out the brake pedal on the Kayak which got bent up somewhere near Matlock!

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Re: reverse brake bleed

Post by davebike » Mon Sep 03, 2018 7:20 am

From the advanced rider / ex observer prospective

dry road good condition both brakes together 95% power to front tapering to mostly rear below 20mph unless full ES then just drop the front at the last moment If ABS and emergency it hard on both and let the computer do it's job it is quicker than you ! I stood a ST1300 on it front wheel some years ago left an impressive black line in the road from 60+MPH OK 90 but missed the fool who pulled out and stopped ! ABS works !


wet road or poor condition more rear less front Gently as possible rear only below 20!
If ABS you can use more front and no chance of rear lock up !

remmington
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Re: reverse brake bleed

Post by remmington » Mon Sep 03, 2018 8:14 am

davebike wrote:
Mon Sep 03, 2018 7:20 am
From the advanced rider / ex observer prospective

dry road good condition both brakes together 95% power to front tapering to mostly rear below 20mph unless full ES then just drop the front at the last moment If ABS and emergency it hard on both and let the computer do it's job it is quicker than you ! I stood a ST1300 on it front wheel some years ago left an impressive black line in the road from 60+MPH OK 90 but missed the fool who pulled out and stopped ! ABS works !


wet road or poor condition more rear less front Gently as possible rear only below 20!
If ABS you can use more front and no chance of rear lock up !


Just rear below 20mph. Explain the theory pretty please?

davebike
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Re: reverse brake bleed

Post by davebike » Tue Sep 04, 2018 7:08 am

Front brake at low speed causes front to dip (rise on c90) altering steering angle and unbalancing bike
OK maybe on a small bike the 20 should be 10 but the theory still applies! few if any fall due to locked rear, front locking get most riders!

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gtd65
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Re: reverse brake bleed

Post by gtd65 » Tue Sep 04, 2018 8:29 am

Have to say my super cub is the only bike I've ridden that requires the opposite braking technique.

I'm around 80% rear with 20% front. It's not that I want to do that, it's just that the front is so ineffective.

On any other bike I own, the rear is a tiny fraction of retardation.

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radar
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Re: reverse brake bleed

Post by radar » Mon Sep 17, 2018 9:34 pm

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